Updated DKP System

各位, 由於近來 DKP bidding 機制有些混亂, 以至大家(特別是新加入的朋友)造成不便, 敬請原諒~

在此, 我們希望可以清晰地講解一次, 亦更新了少許細節, 以減少混亂情況~

English Version
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<Updated at 2011.02.10 (In Yellow)>

1. "Puntual Bonus" DKP 2 point will be given to members who attend on time (9:30pm HKT).
   
   
2. (Attendence Point) Each member will get DKP 3 point in each zone;
   If attend after the first named and during the zone, a member will only get DKP 2 point;
   If attend nearly the end of the zone, a member will only get DKP 1 point.
   
   
3. If Clear zone, each member will get DKP 1 point more.
   
   
4. From 30/12/2010, "Puntual Bonus" and "Attendence Point" will be updated in the guild window before the first bidding of every zone.
   
   
5. Member has two types "new raider" and "raider": "new raider" is who first joins raid. The decision of when a "new raider" will be promoted to "raider" is made by guild leaders (Ashare, Kylex, Viza) after guild leaders' discussion.
   
   
6. In every bidding, main can use a multiple of DKP 5 point to bid,
   where main has higher priority than alt, and "raider" has higher priority than "new raider".
   "new raider" can only use DKP 5 point at maximum to bid in every bidding,
   and "new raider" can only bid for their main.
   
   
7. Alt bidding (only for "raider"):
   "raider" use a multiple of DKP 1 point to bid for their alt. After win the bid for alt, need to use 30pp + dkp.
   
   For example, Player A and Player B both want an item
   　　Player A : alt 1
   　　Player B : alt 2
   　　Player A: alt 5
   　　Player B: pass
   Player A needed to pay 30pp + 5 dkp to get the item.
   
   Money will be used to buy master spell for all raiders of Saviours or buy buff flags or pay GH upkeep.
   
   
8. Exemption for alt bidding
   - one raider can register 1 raid alternate
   - the registered raid alternate can use only 10pp while other non-raid alternate still need 30pp
   - the following is the raid alternate list
   　　　　http://saviours.find-forum.net/t66-registered-raid-alternate-list
   
   Please feel free to let guild leaders know if missed anyone. (Guild leaders will make the final decision)
   In case your alternate has been summoned many times, you can make a request to guild leaders
   to review the status of adding your alternate as registered raid alternate.
   
   
9. Bidding needs to be said out in raid channel within the count down (1, 2, 3) by raid leader.
   
   
10. Each member can bid with how many DKP points the member has.
    E.g.: I have DKP 4 points in guild window. If I want to bid for my main, I will be unable to bid as I do not have enough DKP (5 point).
    E.g.: I have DKP 45 points in guild window. If I want to bid for my main and others are bidding at DKP 50 points, I will be unable to bid as I do not have enough DKP.
    
    
11. "new raider" who first joined after 30/12/2010 will get DKP 20 point.
    

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中文版
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<更新於2011.02.10 (In Yellow)>

1. 每個 member 準時出席 (9:30pm), 會有"準時 bonus" DKP 2 分.
   
   
2. (出席分) 每個 zone 每個 member 可得 DKP 3 分;
   如在第一隻 named 之後和該 zone 的中途之間加入, 每個 member 只得 DKP 2 分;
   如在該 zone 的尾聲加入, 每個 member 只得 DKP 1 分.
   
   
3. Clear zone, 每個 member 會得 DKP 1 分.
   
   
4. 由 30/12/2010 開始, 所有"準時 bonus" 和 "出席分" 會在一個 zone 的第一個 bidding 前 更新在 guild window.
   
   
5. member 會分 new raider 和 raider 兩種: new raider 是新加入的, new raider 何時成為 raider 由 guild leaders (Ashare, Kylex, Viza) 商討後決定.
   
   
6. 每次 bidding, main 要用 5 分的陪數去投,
   而 main 比 alt 優先, raider 比 new raider 優先.
   new raider 每次最多只可用 5 分去投, 及 new raider 只可投給 main.
   
   
7. Alt bidding (只適合 "raider"):
   "raider" 可用 1 分的陪數去投給 alt. 當投價成功, 要給 30pp 和 dkp.
   
   例, Player A 和 Player B 一同叫價
   　　Player A : alt 1
   　　Player B : alt 2
   　　Player A: alt 5
   　　Player B: pass
   Player A 要給 30pp + 5 dkp
   
   所獲之金錢將會用作 Saviours 買 master spell 給所有 raiders 或買 buff 旗 或 GH 交租.
   
   
8. alt bidding 的豁免
   - 每一個 raider 可註冊一個 raid alternate
   - 已註冊的 raid alternate 可只用 10pp 而其他的 alternate 仍要用 30pp
   - 以下是已註冊的 raid alternate 名單
   　　　　http://saviours.find-forum.net/t66-registered-raid-alternate-list
   
   如有遺漏, 請通知 guild leaders. (Guild leaders 有最後決定權)
   如你的 alt 被召用在 raid 很多次, 你可向 guild leaders 要求新增你的 alt 入這名單.
   
   
9. 叫價要在 raid leader 叫三聲內在 raid channel 叫價.
   
   
10. 每個 member 只可用所擁有的 DKP 分去叫價, 希望由 30/12/2010 開始沒有負分出現.
    例: 我在 guild window 的 DKP 分有 4 分, 而我想為我的 main 叫價, 由於我不足夠 5 分, 我便不能叫價.
    例: 我在 guild window 的 DKP 分有 45 分, 而我想為我的 main 叫價, 當別人叫價到50分, 由於我不足夠分數, 我便不能叫價.
    
    
11. 30/12/2010 後新加入的 "new raider" 會有 DKP 20 分.
    

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溫馨提示: 如你所擁有的 DKP 分不多, 可盡量不為 alt 投, 以致可以為 main 儲一些分數來投.

如大家有任何不明白 , 請在此發表. 謝謝.

.

中英都有. 勁!!! Thanks a lot!!!

有關DKP系統小弟有以下建議及補充.這只是本人一個普通MEMBER的個人意見.並不是GUILD LEADER或OFFICIER的官方方案.

A.獲得DKP的程序

1.每個準時出席及直至到RAID的完成時間的MEMBER, 會有"出勤BONUS" DKP 2
遲到或早退皆不會得到''出勤BONUS''
BOX CHAR不會有''出勤BONUS''
RAID的完成時間是指原定在GUILD WEB的完結時間.此為最遲完成RAID的時間.
RAID可以在GUILD WEB所定的完成時間後繼續進行.而不再繼續的MEMBER仍然會有"出勤BONUS"
如遇有特別情況,如SERVER DOWN,則由RAID LEADER決定當天是否要提早RAID的完成時間.如決定提早完成,則所有出席到該時間的RAID MEMBER都可以有"出勤BONUS"
如RAID MEMBER中途需要暫時AFK或LOGOUT總時間超過10MIN.RAID LEADER 可因應個別情況決定是否取消有關RAID MEMBER該次RAID的"出勤BONUS"
如RAID MEMBER中途需要暫時AFK或LOGOUT總時間超過30MIN.則要取消有關RAID MEMBER該次RAID的"出勤BONUS"

2.(出席分) 每殺死一個BOSS,每個有參與的任何成員可得 DKP 1分.
BOSS是指有RAID SEAL出的NAMED
BOX CHAR不會有(出席分),不納入為有參與的成員
無論CLEAR ZONE與否,ZONE是沒有DKP,只計殺BOSS的數目

3.(BOSS PENALTY) 如在殺某一BOSS時RAID WIPE,則最後就算殺了該BOSS都不會有該BOSS(出席分)的DKP.之前或之後的BOSS不受影響.

4.(BOSS BONUS)如殺的BOSS是GUILD首次成功則會有DKP2分
首次成功殺的BOSS不會有 BOSS PENALTY.總之殺到就會有BOSS BONUS
首次成功殺的BOSS是以GUILD RAID計.而不是以RAID MEMBER個體計.即是GUILD RAID首次成功殺BOSS後,其他之前未有殺過該BOSS的MEMBER再成功殺BOSS都不會有 BOSS BONUS

5.所有即日所得的DKP會在下一個RAID前更新在 guild window.即日得到的DKP最快要到下一個RAID才可使用
為避免糾紛,不能即時使用新得到的DKP
新得到的DKP同時亦需要得到有關MEMBER的確定無誤.
MEMBER可在RAID後自行檢查所得的DKP數量是否正確.如有問題,盡量在下一個RAID前提出及修正.

B.成員的級別(RAID部份有關)

1.所有新加入的成員一般都會先設定為''MEMBER''或''ALT MEMBER''.個別特別情況有時會將新成員設定為RECRUIT
成員需要在加入時需要詳細考慮,選擇所加入的CHAR是該成員的MAIN或 ALT
MAIN會成為MEMBER,每個成員只可有一個MAIN( 指單一PLAYER)無論該成員帶有多個ACCOUNT加入.
MAIN CHAR一旦選定是不能更改的
所有MAIN以外加入的CHAR都會設定為''ALT MEMBER''
''MEMBER''可向LEADER或OFFICIER申請成為''RAIDER''申請需要7天處理時間.

2.成為RAIDER的要求如下
90LV
230AA或以上(有待再相確)
有足夠的HP(有待再相確),FIGHTER約20000以上,SCOUT約16000以,MAGE約15000以上,HEALER約18000以上
GEAR:大慨PVP或YELLOW ADO ARMOUR以上. 由於GEAR比較多元化.由OFFICER評估是否及格.
ADOMENT:所有可裝入ADOMENT的都要裝置
需要付出40DKP年費.該40DKP會在成功申請成為RAIDER後扣除.申請如不成功不會扣除.建議之後每年2月份統一扣除(如在12月到翌年2月之間成為''RAIDER''則可括免翌年2月的年費
未能如期交年費的RAIDER會轉回為MEMBER.所有ALT MEMBER的競投資格全部即時取消.
每個MEMBER(指單一PLAYER)只可以有一個RAIDER
如GUILD LEADER或OFFICIER是RAIDER,則在GUILD WINDOW內註明

C.以DKP競投RAID LOOT物品

1.成為競投者的資格

ALT MEMBER需要向GUILD LEADER或OFFICIER申請競投資格.完成後才可以競投RAID LOOT物品.
成員的MAIN必需為RAIDER
成員要為該ALT MEMBER交20DKP年費.如有關ALT MEMBER不需競投RAID LOOT物品,則沒有需要交年費
年費是以每個獨立ALT MEMBER計.即是如果成員想其中2位ALT MEMBER可競投RAID LOOT物品,則2位ALT MEMBER都要個別交付年費.
該20DKP會由MAIN支付扣除,轉到該ALT MEMBER的GUILD WINDOW內,保留致下一次收取年費時間.保留的20DKP是為了標示有關ALT MEMBER已交年費.是個記認.不能再使用.
建議每年2月份統一清除保留的20DKP標示(如在12月到翌年2月之間交了年費'則可括免翌年2月的清除)
交年費後,競投資格會在翌日生效.即是不可以在即場RAID交費後即時競投
如成員的MAIN退出公會,其仍留在公會的ALT MEMBER競投資格會即時取消.如需競投則需再次申請
如成員的ALT MEMBER退出公會,其仍留在公會的其他CHAR競投資格不會受到影響

任何RAIDER都自動有競投資格,無需申請

MEMBER的競投資格要求如下
LV90
190AA或以上(有待再相確)

未有加入本公會的CHAR不可競投

2.競投者的優先次序

在參與RAID的成員先競投
在參與RAID的成員比不在RAID的成員優先競投,
在參與成員可為其下任何一個CHAR在參與RAID的成員
優先權次序為RAIDER先競投
如沒有RAIDER競投,則到MEMBER及合資格的ALT MEMBER同時競投
MEMBER跟合資格競投的ALT MEMBER優先權相等.但RAID LEADER可因應個別情況,考慮以加強RAID的實力,讓''MEMBER''級成員在此階段優先競投
如沒有任何在參與RAID的成員先競投.RAIDER LEADER可選擇將該身物品TRANSMUTE或由其他不在RAID的成員競投

不在RAID的成員競投
優先權次序為RAIDER先競投
如沒有RAIDER競投,則到MEMBER及合資格的ALT MEMBER同時競投
MEMBER跟合資格競投的ALT MEMBER優先權相等.但RAID LEADER可因應個別情況,考慮以加強RAID的實力,讓''MEMBER''級成員在此階段優先競投
如沒有任何成員競投.RAIDER LEADER將該身物品TRANSMUTE

3.競投的程序及細則
RAID LOOT物品的競投為公開在RAID CHANNEL叫價競投.
由RAID LEADER或指定人員負責叫價的三次告示.
叫價在三次告示後如再沒有更高叫價就會完成
RAIDER級別起叫價為5DKP每口加大的叫價為5DKP或其倍數
MEMBER及ALT MEMBER級別起叫價為1DKP每口加大的叫價沒有限制
成員的叫價必須要為可支付的DKP,不可負分
沒有DKP的新成員,亦不可負分競投.
任何成員,可以將自已的DKP加入未足7天的新成員戶口.
每個成員最多可以供給5DKP,只可以供給一次.最多只可接受4個成員的供給
供給的DKP在翌日生效.即是不可以在即場RAID供給後即時競投

好多謝Lookot既意見， 我地會參考你既提議並在不久將來再更新DKP系統時，把你既思想溶入當中。
我地會在下一個expansion之前再下檢討.

Thank you

/clap for all changes and proposed changes
great work

Original post updated with underlined

小弟對現行的bid rule,有關alt的bid有以下幾點覺得需要考慮

1. 確定何為alt (考慮保障公會的利益)
bid rules內所指的alt是否必要是已加入本公會內的char?
即是raider是否可以bid給其account內的其他不在本公會的char?甚至bid給其在其它公會的char是否可以?

2. 確定alt數量是否沒有限制 (考慮平衡alt多及alt少的成員的利益)
raider同一account內的alt的數量是否沒有限制?
如成員有多個account,其它accout的char,alt是否有不同定義?

3. 確定alt是否有要求資格 (考慮對比不同成員alt對公會可作出的貢獻)
例如需要有80lv之類的要求?還是1lv的char都可以bid?

Alt bid rule

From now on, all raiders need to use 30pp + dkp to bid for alt.
This will only affect alternate looting.

For example, Player A and Player B both want an item

Player A : alt 1
Player B : alt 2
Player A: alt 5
Player B: pass

Player A needed to pay 30pp + 5 dkp to get the item.

Money will use to buy master spell or buy buff flags or pay GH upkeep

lonely made very good point.

my suggestions to address this are:
1. each person only can claim 1 alt class to loot, so the alt loot is more balanced through all people.
2. raise alt bid miniumn 20 or 30dkp each, so everyone will think more carefully if they really want spend dkp for alt.

anyway, the plat alt bid system is good, at least i think for most ppl in guild who are rich

1. It would be better if we can define what is ALT and the quilification for bid

_____a. I suggest ALT must be guild member, included multi-accout char

_____b. if no guild ALT apply, then we accept raider to "buy the loot" for his char which not in our guild directly for 60pp base vaule

_____c. if more than one people want to "buy the loot" then we take an internal biding

2. As new expension is about to release, new item is more valuable and a fixed price of 30pp may be not flexible enough

3. I suggest that the ALT bid shoulld as follow for the Money +DKP version

_____a. base ALT bid price 30pp

_____b. the ALT need to pay 5pp more for each DKP

_____c. for example, if an ALT win the alt bid with 5dkp, then he should pay 30+(5x5)=55pp for the loot and 5dkp deducted

4. For the PP income, I suggest the follow

_____a. each 3 month all raider share the PP income once

_____b. the total PP income, 50% for guild fund and 50% for raider to share

_____c. the share rate is refer to the amount of DKP the raider have. (can explain if anyone interest this method)

just some selfish idea.

1/ Totally agree with the registration. 1 + 1 or 1 +2 is ok .. i think most of us got more than 3 char ??
2/ Suggest to lower the pp to 10pp or 15pp.. donlt draw too much pp from guildmate is better i think ??
3/ Although we might use higher DKP bid for alt, the item fee (30pp) should not increase.. --> if guild need money, why not just ask us give guild $$ in monthly/quarterly basis? For me, I will be more comfort to pay pp to support guild directly..

I know that many guild-mates may think this policy is enforced with a little bid rush. However, the main reason is that we encourage people to focus on main character and do not abuse on bidding items for alternate characters.
Player should think twice before bidding the item.. In the past, some of us bid the item without thinking ( so am I ).
For example, I had once got duplicated items before and then I had to transmute it. Therefore, under this new policy, I will really think thoroughly before I bid any item for alternate character.

Moreover, the money we collected will be used to purchase master spells or items that can benefit to the raid/guild. This money is in the Guild Bank and is not belonged to anyone of us.

Thank you

Any suggestions are welcome and will work out together

我的想法是基於平衡.

考慮不論成員有很多ALT還是只有一個MAIN,是HARDCORE還是CASUAL
在公會的不斷發展,從WOE的時候不夠2隊人,到現在曾經有一批新成員加入,而出現過FULL RAID.
是需要有一個良好的"資源分配"制度去平衡,才可以團結成員繼續發展.

但凡一個新EXPANSION出台,都必有一批搶手貨.不會像現時的冷清.

1. 何為ALT是需要訂明的.同時亦需要明確ALT的競投權.是很重要的,一直不定就一直有問題

2. 如果ALT需要附加PP來競投RAID LOOT,那麼就以"分紅"方式來平衡

____A. 將一部份的收益給公會,另一部份以DKP的多少比例,攤分給各成員.

____B. 請想一想,不只是你的ALT要付PP,其他的會員的ALT都要付.你是有機會賺PP的

____(唉....如果只有一個MAIN而沒有ALT,拿著用不完的DKP,就是不想開ALT也迫到開些出來消費一下DKP吧~~)

3. RAID LOOT不應以劃一定價來收費

____A. RAID LOOT的價值是浮動的.會員用越多的DKP來投就代表該RAID LOOT越有價值.應該將收費跟DKP的用量成一個正比.

____B. RAID LOOT應該要有一個底價,來做利益的平衡.以現時的"市況"30PP作為底價,我認為是合理的.

yes, i agree lonely's opinion on alt.

I suggest we can just decide some alt that the guild will use in raid , and some alt that guild will not use.

example:

damnbard can have templar+zerker as raid alt that will be used in raid, then she can have 2 alt that she can bid on for alt with dkp alone.
sizuz can have dirge as raid alt that will be used in raid, then he can have 1 alt that he can bid on for alt with dkp alone.

then all other toons are going to be plat alts, using plat to bid, if no raid alt need.

I agreed that we need to stop crazy bid item for alt and the registration of Main / Alt. ( no. of alt let leader decided ba, but I think should be limited to 1 only, box char should be counted.)

But why not just use same bid rule for raid alt ? use 5 DkP for each bid.

why crazy bid, because we all have too much alt.. so, for the third, forth, fifth.... n-th alts (include box char) .. I totally agree to pay pp + DKP, guild not that necessary need to feed we all alt.
Main point is.. although I am not a rich guy, i am still ok to deposit money to our guild bank to support our guild operation.

But I do not think we need to buy item in this way. we are a guild...

Thank you for all your comments/ideas, after our discussion, we agree to give some exemption on raid alternate

- one raider can register 1 raid alternate
- raid alternate can use only 10pp to get one raid item while other non-raid alternate still need 30pp to get one item
- the following is the raid alternate list based on my understanding


Ashare (Dirge) -> Cityone (Warden)
Viza (ShadowKnight) - > Vica (Defiler)
Defilerd (Defiler) - > Fatesn (Berserk)
Suziz (ShadowKnight) - > Uxee (Dirge)
Damnbard (Troubadour) -> Loriannie (Templar)
Lampgod (Illusionist) - > Palm (Inquisitor)
Kack (Assassin) - > Molook (Warden)

Please feel free to let me know if I have missed anyone. (Guild leaders will make the final decision)
The above list is just a temporary list and I will open a new page to register your raid alternate

In case your alternate has been summoned many times, your can make a request to guild leaders to review the status of adding your alternate as raid alternate


We will update the DKP system later accordingly.

good change, also , i am wondering... maybe should not split plat from chest in raid.
so that guild can maintain more plat income.......also, boxed toon are getting x2 of the plat split from chest, which is not fair.